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Research Treaties are too expensive.

research;treaties;treaty;expe

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Shooter_Macgavin #1 Posted 26 January 2017 - 08:58 AM

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Research Treaties

 

Research treaties are too expensive, especially mid-to-late game. I can't afford them, and the AI can never afford them as they never have any money to spare. It probably goes into all the pollution-control buildings they don't need.

The Psilons particularly miss out because no one can afford research treaties.

Perhaps change the way research treaties are entered into. Two (or more) parties agree to build, guard, and maintain a mutual secret research facility (the location will be initially secret, but not its existence). All parties will need to pay for its upkeep and it generates substantial research points over time for all parties involved. The treaty will not end unless any participating party pulls out, or the secret facility is discovered and destroyed by Antarans, pirates, or any other race. If the facility is lost for any reason, all parties will cease gaining the research generated at the facility, and all parties involved will suffer a disposition hit towards one another, as each blames the others for losing the facility. A brief leader cutscene saying "You suck.", or something to that effect would be nice.

Every other race not involved in the collaboration will get a warning that the treaty is being entered into and by which races. A GNN announcement would be nice. The proposed treaty will be announced, a new announcement when the facility is finally constructed, but not its location. If playing with AI, make them amenable to an alliance, or a new temporary alliance, to hunt down and destroy the facility (which of course would put you at war with the facility owners).

A new espionage mission will become available to discover the location of the secret research facility. You will find this mission under 'Empire Missions' under any of the involved parties. Obviously go for the one with the lowest security. The race that slips up and reveals the location of the facility due to slack security will suffer an additional disposition hit to all other involved parties.

If the intent of research treaties was to have a workable mechanic for the entirety of the game, then that has not been achieved, it becomes too costly. If this is intended to only be used early-mid game, then ok. I suggest that, if we want this mechanic to be used the whole game, simply reduce the cost, which would be the easy solution, or change it up a bit to make things more interesting, to encourage alliances, a greater emphasis on map control, and more espionage missions.

In conclusion, this change would make research treaties:

1) more affordable
2) more interesting
3) add more dynamics to the game.



Exoclyps #2 Posted 27 January 2017 - 10:19 AM

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The ironic part here is that I think Psilons actually benefit from research treaties being too expensive since it means that the only means to research is with your own people, which is what they excel at. If half the research was from treaties their bonus advantage would be halved.

 

But I do agree, currently research treaties aren't doing any good. It is possible to mod them to reduce the cost so that they can be used a bit longer (even modded I had to chug up 20k to enter a treaty with the Psilons late game, that only gave me the same result as my best research planet, but then again, I was using +research trait.) But with some lesser races the price was quite decent and mid-game it can turn into quite an advantage.

 

That said, I really want to see a Research Treaty trait. Mostly to races like the Humans as they had such bonus back in MoO2.



Shooter_Macgavin #3 Posted 28 January 2017 - 01:42 AM

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View PostExoclyps, on 27 January 2017 - 10:19 AM, said:

The ironic part here is that I think Psilons actually benefit from research treaties being too expensive since it means that the only means to research is with your own people, which is what they excel at. If half the research was from treaties

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their bonus advantage would be halved.

 

But I do agree, currently research treaties aren't doing any good. It is possible to mod them to reduce the cost so that they can be used a bit longer (even modded I had to chug up 20k to enter a treaty with the Psilons late game, that only gave me the same result as my best research planet, but then again, I was using +research trait.) But with some lesser races the price was quite decent and mid-game it can turn into quite an advantage.

 

That said, I really want to see a Research Treaty trait. Mostly to races like the Humans as they had such bonus back in MoO2.

 



Shooter_Macgavin #4 Posted 28 January 2017 - 01:43 AM

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I have no idea how to quote people in forum posts correctly.

 


Edited by Shooter_Macgavin, 28 January 2017 - 01:44 AM.


Shooter_Macgavin #5 Posted 28 January 2017 - 01:49 AM

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View PostExoclyps, on 27 January 2017 - 10:19 AM, said:

The ironic part here is that I think Psilons actually benefit from research treaties being too expensive since it means that the only means to research is with your own people, which is what they excel at. If half the research was from treaties their bonus advantage would be halved.


 

 

 


 

I thought that Psilons would suffer from lack of research treaties in that, assuming both parties obtained equal research points from the treaty (I'm not sure about this) the Psilons would benefit more, as they gain all choices from a tech.



Exoclyps #6 Posted 28 January 2017 - 09:05 AM

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Well, lets put it like this.

 

True that psilons would indirectly benefit more from Research Treaties than other races due to the Creative trait. However you need to take into consideration of their +50% from cells.


Imagine if you currently get 50 research points from structures and 200 from population. The regular person get 250 and Psilons would get 350, 40% more than the regular person.

Now lets say you add in research treaties for say 100 research points.  The regular person now get 350 points and the Psilons would get 450 points, 28.6% more than the regular person.

 

More research points from treaties in comparison to population and it's even worse. Meaning Psilons will have a harder time to create a tech gap between themself and their opponents.

 

That said, I'm all for Research Treaties being cheaper if made right, just that Psilons would be the losers here rather than the winners.






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